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**MrGoodbar714** · 01-12-2014, 02:26 AM

Funny that you mention this... When I first came to the PXS forums I asked Steve for the same thing... I pretty much wanted the "Lazy Mans mone" where women would open me. He replied that he didn't think there'd ever be a mone blend that would cause women to open guys, perhaps this may be true... But who knows. I have a theory as to why there may be more "blatant" hits w AD's products and its just a theory... I think it has to do with the sillage and strength of AD's scents. I've noticed AD's scents to last alot longer and stronger than SteveO's. Not taking anything away from his blends cuz they do produce results, but perhaps sillage of the scents is the issue?... Just a thought...

**PheroJack** · 01-12-2014, 03:05 AM

@MrGoodbar, since day 1 that I've tried testing I've always questioned the diffusion with XS products. There's one simple way to put this: XS products do NOT hit fast! Not fast compared to AD that's 100% sure.

That's why they hit, they hammer... that's why people see more results the longer the targets are exposed to them... that's why Cohesion (so far the most potent in terms of strength of scent, even though it's FXS like all my other products) had in your face hits compared to any others products...

I really would appreciate SteveO to shed some light on this issue because so far, it's more than just a couple of people complaining or just running into some bad luck... Matter fact, I think people here and pherotruth sometimes overhype the effects of products here... I know it might be because SteveO is awesome running his business but it's all about consistency and actually improving things.

Top of my head, XyZN, KIMBA, MrGood, Dignify have and/or are still finding the diffusion thing to be an issue. And if you notice these are the people most consistently and frequently testing the products and actually reporting about them.

**KIMBA** · 01-12-2014, 04:01 AM

Diffusion is an issue with every vendor. Only ads 297 got me huge in my face results. I think I have the most 297 experience in field bar maybe Pago. It is pure party value attraction, hard to convert to a girlfriend, little to no arousal. No romance. If you like sleeping with girls who star fish and arnt really into it 297 is great. When I was in PUA to get more lays I loved it, but it's harder to get good sex with those lays. That was the only product to really get me those in your face results. Some products have bad diffusion, but it applies to all vendors. I have diffusion tricks but in reality instant results are not instant. Before a girl opens you or before she DIHL the fact is she was exposed to your cloud before you noticed her. Steve doesn't have a life of the party product yet, because besides 297, only wing man black label gets a result some what like that. But still nothing is the same as 297. Scent may have something to do with it. Steve's are very concentrated and less alcohol and more mone. That's true. One spray of Steve's is five sprays of ads. You add ethanol of your own to thin it out and it works better. AD used mainly Akuto or Neroli as standard because of diffusion. Pepper and nutmeg works just as well in my experience. I get opened with Steve's SOB. Pretty much only that product gives me girls opening me. I have to open with 297 more than SOB even. I don't want to say avert intentions, but using the wrong product and expecting the same results is a. If problem. I don't want attention, I want results and success. 297 is beta, anti arousal. I get laid off it easy, and have fun, but it's a huge disadvantage that can weigh on you.

**PheroJack** · 01-12-2014, 05:34 AM

Great post KIMBA!

Now, what would you pair MX297 with to make it more desirable? I prefer XS products suggestion. I read the thread you did in PT about it (awesome shit my friend!). But what do you say would mix well from XS?

Very interested in equivalent of P96 here which SteveO claims to have in research molecule section but we kind of have to figure out which one it is :(...

Also in 297 + Beta -Nol + P83 + NPA... what would be the XS equivalent of the extras?

You think 297 + IS + AMMO = 297 + Bliss + Taboo?

I do agree about Steve's mones having more mones concentration than any other vendor (everyone saying that) and he also tried his best to increase the longevity of effects which comes at a cost for diffusion VS. Ad's more blatant hits for less than couple hours, then almost no effects afterwards and needing to reapply...

Always felt like I HAD to get my togo with me with AD to refresh... never once I felt that with XS.

But seriously the idea of me diluting products doesn't sound so good because I don't have a sterile environment where I can safely open two bottles etc.... Last time I did that I found hair, dirt and lint in the bottle afterwards.

You talked about tricks to increase diffusion? Aside from applying lotion beforehand, mind sharing your other mighty "tricks"?

**Dioxonus** · 01-12-2014, 08:20 AM

Yeah I completely agree with you PJ and Kimba about diffusion. I thought I was the only one who didn't get instant results. I thought I OD and it was me who wasn't doing something correct. XS is my first mones I truly have bought so I do not know about AD's stuff. That's what I am really looking for is to get blatant hits so I can react to them and easy to spot. If it goes slow and natural it is quite hard to differentiate what is caused by mones.

I am also stuck on how to use my ACE as well. Do I need to work with the sig they are giving for them to fully work?

**Dignify** · 01-12-2014, 09:18 AM

To be honest I found, as I noted in my journal, that when 'mones are not dried to be the best. And Jack commented on that as well.

This is like literally less than 5 minutes I would say from when I apply them till I meet up with my someone. This by the way was tested by CJ's mix; XIST + LB + Taboo (Thanks to CJ and K for bringing it up

) all FXS .

I would say the in your face effects were there and are fine as I have had a lot of stuff going with her and we're friends and I didn't say everything in my journal cause some were awkward

.

But yes, I second that something that would enhance diffusion rate after dry down would be best as the products do have potential and I've witnessed that, but once they dry down it starts to cut back. IMO diffusion > longevity. But that's for my case as I only get to spend with her like 1-3 hours as a max and I'm not really interested in others getting hit thereafter lol.

**KIMBA** · 01-12-2014, 10:42 AM

I have mentioned all this before but here I go! As far as replacements from Steve, Taboo is a very good product to stiffen up 297 playfully, ammo didn't work for me, taboo did. Enough said. I also use domination with 297. Domination is superior to new NPA in my book. Steve sells beta nol, by the way. Instant shine made 297 good because of TAA, but TAA is very short lived and just makes opening easier. When Steve cracks and releases tac and TAA I am done with ad. Just two products I can't replicate. Also, side note, my phone won't make paragraphs. Weird. Only this site. I digress. Lotion increases longevity, no diffusion increase. But lotion is the great equalizer in respect to your skin prematurely absorbing them. To increase diffusion you want to maximize diffusion area, this is big for oils. Hd sprayer at least six inches away from skin. For proper projection you MUST allow dry down time. Once all your product is dried down I apply cologne on top or I apply cologne first to increase diffusion of molecules. It helps greatly. Body heat is a factor. You must have a raised body heat to increase diffusion. I on occasion take a thermogenic pill or work out before applying product. Works wonderfully. I also advise adding ethanol/everclear/alcohol to your product on your skin. Then mixing them with your finger, am wiping some product on neck/behind ears. More alcohol means more of a carrier and faster diffusion. Ever notice how ads products seem very watery? A lot more alcohol. You can mimic of. Be careful, two much alcohol smells. On occasion I do this with cologne when I use two or three cologne sprays and am going to a club. These are off the top of my head, hope they help.

**MaliciousIntent** · 01-12-2014, 02:22 PM

I think the BCE and BCTaboo combo is the closest thing to what you are describing, I found this beyond my comfort level. One girl yanked my scarf, another drug me off a couch and pounced me in front of her ex, and Taboo has a habit of turning the conversation dirty. Girls dont approch guys they signal them over. Women opening on guys is just backwards for a number of reasons.

I've been thinking of doing an O-X-LB/T mix but Im sure id get myself killed.

An idea for diffusion, I've seen little gel scent diffusers what if it had mones in it?

Homemade Essential Oil Air Fresheners

http://www.foodiewithfamily.com/2010/03/17/homemade-essential-oil-air-fresheners/

Have you ever noticed that males of all species have a tendency to (How can I put this delicately?) be malodorous? I'm talking from a position of knowledge and experience here; I have a husband,

like so like a little gel pack in your pocket. I've gotten the best results out of taboo with one spray applied INSIDE my front chest pocket.

**Dignify** · 01-12-2014, 03:39 PM

Bliss? Actually I still don't understand the product as in what it does etc. Doesn't it make you and others relaxed and worry free?

**XyzN** · 01-12-2014, 04:53 PM

Probably the fastest working product I have from XS is Bliss. Stuff hits me and others around me within seconds to a minute or two. I notice Bliss effects last me a whopping 4-6 hours at just 1 spray when at work. Top peak effects the first hour or two.

Also diffusion for me is hard to control as I mention a lot because I work in a refrigerated area, so it's often on the cool side. I'm probably the warmest one at work always because 75% of the other co-workers wear additional clothing like sleeves and jackets. I myself and few others wear just t-shirt. I've had a co-worker on her own accord, place her hand on my back and felt how warm my back was and said I was very warm. I usually am pretty content with temps when I'm actually working. I sometimes almost break a sweat under heavier times. Just to clarify my problems with diffusion you may of read from me is just for work usually.

I may now start using AD's Ammo again in my daily work blends to increase diffusion. The scent is the bomb for me and provides adequate sillage for me at just 1 spray, the low phero count doesn't seem to throw of my mixes

I was for the time being, just using FXS scented products to see if I was diffusing enough. I have on occasion mixed Ammo into my blends and all seems well.
I didn't want to be wearing 2 scents all the time at work and be "that cologne guy" and invalidating my results a bit.

**MaliciousIntent** · 01-12-2014, 07:11 PM

Originally posted by Dignify View Post

Bliss? Actually I still don't understand the product as in what it does etc. Doesn't it make you and others relaxed and worry free?

Connections = sip of a relaxation drink
Bliss = 4 sips of a relation drink ( some attention span is gonna go )
Odyssey = same effect but leading to being high on pot. Shouldnt operate machinary or be around people that do. a contact high + this makes ppl putty or childlike.

all three stop people from deeply analyzing things.

Odyssey was made for rave's if im not mistaken try starting there?

O-X I think would be 'daddy'
O-E I think she would be to out of it to be sexual.
O-T maybe
O-C I've tested this one kills a woman's kino zone. I infused the air in my house with it to great effect. an 'none product is then used to act as a homing for you.
O-A seems like shittest hell.
O-LB may be?

Xist and Bliss are the only mones I've found that are remotely 'energizing' and that would be what is needed fro 'life-of the party' most mones are comforting relaxing or druging.

**2000GT** · 01-13-2014, 02:22 PM

Here's my two cents on this topic. It's not far off from a post I made a year or two ago on PT regarding how expected effects are a result of sociological and demographic conditions.

Basically, almost all of modern society is still a predominantly male lead society. Based on a genetic disposition from our cave dwelling days, men were the hunters, women the care givers. as such, it was assumed at the time that the man is supposed to take the lead and initiate mating. Of course in some one off societies, you'll find that this is not the case however for the overwhelming majority of society, it's still the case, even if it's very slowly starting to change. That said, given that this concept is still heavily ingrained into the human condition, it's counter intuitive for a woman to initiate mating rituals unless provoked in a manner that they feel if they don't, they stand to lose any chance to procreate (biological clock ticking can be a determining factor). In situations where a woman does initiate would be as stated previously with said biological clock, or if the woman is not highly desired, has had bad luck with men and is becoming frustrated (ties back into the biological clock issue), or in the case with online dating, if the woman has some sort of physical attribute that is not socially accepting as being desirable (physical deformities, handicaps or excessive weight to name a few), then she will be more inclined to break through the social barriers in order to get what she wants.

So how does this play into the concept of a phero signature that compels women to initiate? Well, in my experience, in order to do so, the wearer needs to be able to work with the signature he/she is wearing. It also helps to know what generally drives a woman to desire a man. Know also that there are sociological groupings for all women, some that fall in certain groups, some that don't or on either end of the respective bell curves of any particular grouping. An example. Let's say that women who generally wear very revealing clothing while also having a fit physique are the type that could have confidence issues and are more likely to act on their impulses. Provided they find a guy that fits what they are looking for (maybe the bad guy, the jock, someone with a tough attitude that would more likely smack them around, etc), they may be more inclined to act on their physiological urges. Now within that group, we have women who either meet that stereotype to the extreme, or not at all. The not at all portion would be women who dress in such a way for other reasons, be it confidence issues, manipulation of men (possible sociopaths) or women who are dressing up in such a fashion in a one off manner (holloween for example).

So where the hell am I going with this? You can wear a phero signature that may indicate that you have a tough, bad boy vibe with a sexual charge. Combine the right circumstances (women who most likely to respond well to such a signature and a dis-inhibitor such as a phero based one or alcohol for example) and you'll have success. In this type of scenario, you may get a more aggressive response from women. But a lot of women still prefer the man to initiate and as those of us whom have studied this field for a while can tell you, if the woman is conditioned to believe a man must initiate, unless they are extremely inebriated or otherwise not completely in control of their own faculties, you "may" get a semi loosening of the inhibitions but generally, it's still required to initiate. I have extreme doubts about any product that claims to do the majority of the work for you unless it's in regards to a particular type of person and situation that you are targeting, combined with the right type of personality to go hand in hand with what the target is looking for.

Short hand is if you want to achieve such a result, you need to project the right kind of phero signature, the type of personality that matches the signature and is the right type of personality that your target would find irresistible. If not, you won't get much of a response. Guys, you still need to do some work here. If anything, you may find something that makes it easier but if you need a woman to initiate, that's a problem. Sure it's nice to have a woman initiate but in this society, it's not very common.

For reference, here's my original post from PT which should explain further what I mean:

While I know that this topic has been discussed here and there over the years, I thought it would be good for our newer members to look through this and discuss. Also, it's helpful to have a better understanding of how social values come into play with respect to how pheromones can affect any particular person. I've seen a lot of people say "for Asians, use this mix." The problem is that there is an important need for clarification here. An incorrect assumption is being inferred by our newer members that the ethnicity is the main reason for using such a mix when it would be more accurate to say that the culture of said ethnicity is more critical. That is not to say that physiology does not come into play. As I am not a physician, I can not make any statement saying that there is a definitive physiological connection between pheromone mixes and ethnicities. It is my theory that the reason why such mixes are not always effective on a particular ethnicity is that the cultural and social values that the target has been raised with, take precedence over physiological predispositions.

On a more basic level, the social/cultural environment that a person is raised in, will have a greater impact on how they will react to pheromone signatures. Meaning that just because a black woman is assumed to be more receptive to a higher none signature, does not mean that ALL black women will react the same. What would make us assume that a black woman would be more inclined to a higher none signature than say, an Asian? How do we mold our personalities? We learn from what we see. If we have a family that is high aggression and intensity, then we learn that is the norm. Freud once assumed that we marry our parents. Perhaps there is some truth to that. We look for what we know and what we know comes from who raised us. My preferences have been towards women of higher class, intelligence, artistic inclinations, etc. This is because I was initially raised in a higher class family with higher class values. What changed for me was at the age of ten, my family lost everything. This didn't change who I was as a person or how my parents thought, but it did require me and my sister to learn humility. Now if I were raised in a highly aggressive environment, one that shows that aggression is the norm, it could be inferred that I would have leanings either towards another woman who is as aggressive as myself or demure, passive.

So how does this play into our use of pheros? If you're looking for a shotgun approach, IE, going to a club and seeing who will respond, then a more well rounded mix, appropriate for a physically and emotionally intense approach will be needed. If you're going on a date with a particular person, then what is important if you're looking for a particular outcome, is to focus more on who they are as a person, their personality, their quirks, etc. Is the person demure, aggressive, sleazy? Does he/she come from a socially conservative background? One with a strict and severe family? Or do they come from an aggressively charged family/background? IE, the inner city where aggressive is the norm, the strong tend to survive, the weak perish type of mentality. If that's the case, then a higher none signature would be useful, also providing that you can remain congruent to your signature. Remember that when you wear pheros otherwise your body language will override what the pheros say and will actually work against you. Also, wearing a higher none signature around a woman whom was raised in a less aggressive environment "Might" put them off. I stress might because as is the case, there are always extremes on either end and variables that can't always be accounted for.

Hopefully I still have your attention here so I end with some tips to keep in mind when figuring out what will work best with a particular person or group.

1. Observe how they dress. Style of clothing will tell you a lot about how a person is. A more conservative style of dress could indicate that Instant Jerk may not be the best option.
2. How a person holds themselves. Body language is very important. A person who walks with slightly hunched shoulders, looks down or doesn't make eye contact could be an indication of social anxiety or confidence issues. Enhancing with more socials would be better, coming off as aggressive might not be a good idea, the person could be scared off by such a vibe.
3. How a person talks. Yes, the way a person talks, the inflections they use, the tone of their voice, their grammatical skills, these can give clues as to how a person behaves, or might react.

As I have said, these are just my observations but I'm reminded of my days at film school when studying film theory. Film theory is the psychology behind film and the essence of film theory is this: "Everything in film is done so for a reason. Set design, costumes, lighting, angles, positioning of the actors." We're in a area of research that requires us to be more observant of how people react towards pheromones. Instead of just focusing on how they react, observe how they are as a person. Getting a gauge of what they might be like as a person can help achieve better results. Obviously we can't always do this but the main thing I'm trying to get at is don't just slap something on and hope for the best. Observe other's for their reactions, tailor to suite the needs, observe how you are as a person and make sure to remain congruent with your signature.

**Dignify** · 01-13-2014, 03:49 PM

IMO that post is worth more than 2 cents

But yes, I agree with that, there's no way a girl would normally open under normal conditions except if she was extremely turned on by a potent sexual product, but even with that she might just go to another guy if you don't do anything (bringing this idea out thanks to K,Jack and 7omislav).

Honestly, I would like to shed more light (Aim several spotlights at it even) on your quote GT quote where you talked about different type of girls (personality wise or physically) as some products might work on some type of girls and others won't and might be seen as coming too strong or even not coming at all. And that's where, I would say, people notice difficulties with 'mones because they are forcing a girl to be a something that they are using these 'mones for rather to bring up what she shines at or what she's lacking. And honestly this is what I'm aiming for when ordering my product as I have a feeling of what these 'mones would result or bring out in my someone.

**Dioxonus** · 01-13-2014, 04:12 PM

Ah right now I get it. It just confused me how some guys where getting some great hits ou of no-where and didn't do a thing and said steve's stuff works like magic which gets you a girl instantly. I kind of think that is false advertising as you should say that you must coexist with your mones and work with them. I have yet to find a company that says that.

I will have to work harder on my testing.

**PheroJack** · 01-13-2014, 11:39 PM

Everyone's responses been simply amazing... this should be a sticky in every pheromone forum!

I totally understand what you're saying now GT.

Now, I feel it's actually like this:

No pheromones --> depending on the girl, must have [good game, looks, status] + in most cases must initiate and excite an attraction flame yourself = success.

With pheromones --> depending on the girl still, must have [good game not necessary, looks matter a little less, no visible status proof] + in most cases must initiate as well = success.

Combine pheromones with good game, taking good care of your looks (physique and clothes) and possible visible social status (friends, VIP, etc...) then you're about to have a new date with a different girl at least 3 times a week if you're not trying that hard.

**Dignify** · 01-14-2014, 12:48 AM

True, and I wanted to write something specially to Ian before rushing into conclusions

and this is a tip maybe for everyone new.

Think of it this way(as it just popped in my head):

You are playing a game and selected your character, the first time you struggle but eventually you get the hang of it and your experience keeps raising as you play more. But don't you buy upgrades for your character? These upgrades will even push your character's power even more than what you could achieve alone. These upgrades however do little work alone, what's the use of a maximum geared character if you're AFK from the game? You'd be an easy target still

Also, you buy upgrades according to who you're fighting with!

IDK just a way of trying to better describe mones that just popped randomly out on my head, 'mones + working with it = more power more than what you could have witnessed without. Now gotta run to uni and run another test cya peeps

**TheBoogieMan** · 01-14-2014, 05:11 PM

Originally posted by IainLPplus44 View Post

Ah right now I get it. It just confused me how some guys where getting some great hits ou of no-where and didn't do a thing and said steve's stuff works like magic which gets you a girl instantly. I kind of think that is false advertising as you should say that you must coexist with your mones and work with them. I have yet to find a company that says that.

I will have to work harder on my testing.

No, false advertisement would be if SteveO said "this stuff is magic and will have beautiful women lined up at your front door for no-strings attached sex".

He hasn't said that. In fact, he and other senior members in the pheromone community have reiterated over and over again that mones are just a small part of the equation towards building a better you.

There is no magic pill in life fellas. Success requires hard work.

**KIMBA** · 01-15-2014, 02:17 AM

Their are two sides pushed on pheros. One is be yourself and they do work, other is you need to work hard to be congruent or they don't work. Which is right? Neither. It's somewhere In the middle. Steve says you need to work some, always has, but disagrees with the dogmatic you must work with the product 100%. People who get hits meet new people, are im gyms, find a woman who clicks with their phero sig, or are in an enduced environment (bar). No big surprises, no? They have diffusion assistance or their targets are more receptive. Another note, guys who get laid off of this, not just looks, go up and socialize. Big surprise. Companies often don't tell us what a product really does (LAL, alpha dream, ads mixes, love scent) and especially don't share nuances. We figure it out. Your body chemistry is different than mind, so are your variables. Looks, height, etc, all play a role as well. DIHL makes you feel the best but gets you the least results, it's an overload. Remember this.

**2000GT** · 01-15-2014, 10:46 AM

Guys, remember, my post points out that with so many variables and outside factors coming into play with women (Genetics, demographics, psychological, physiological, etc), that none of what you find out there will work 100% of the time. Same goes for women to men as well. You could have a woman wear a phero that is supposed to give off the vibe that they are sweet and alluring but not aggressive. That might be what some of us like, but not others. So you'll never get a 100% success rate. Hell, you may not even get 50% success rate unless you're wearing a product that is designed to be well rounded and non specific, whether it's something like Taboo or something more insidious and heavy hitting like the old Panty Scorcher products or Aqua Vitae. I never used PS, but I did use UF which was similar in that regards. It still required the right type of circumstances/environments for it to be truly effective and it didn't work every time, either.

Basically there are too many variables to be accounted for that can affect the visible effects from the products worn. Hence, why it makes more sense to make sure you're not sitting back thinking it'll do the work for you. I used to say this: Think of pheros as lube for the gears. It helps make things run more smoothly but you still need to turn the gears yourself.

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