Hello from Austin, TX

[Atxunicorn]

Fabulous helpful knowledge Scottie2Hottie, thanks

[Scottie2Hottie]

You're welcome. Glad I could help. You've activated my geekdar with those molecules you mentioned. It's leading me in circles. I've slipped down the rabbit hole. I'll be back later.

[Atxunicorn]

Have fun!!!

[Ildergreier]

Welcome.

I can recommend Babe, Tease, Temptress and Psel when dealing with younger men.

[Atxunicorn]

I do have Tease! Oooh I don’t think I’d dare attempt Temptress sounds way too Alpha for me and my current situation. Psel might be interesting but Innocence has also struck my curiosity, especially with that make him want to protect what’s his aspect and secretly he’s a cuddlier (shhhh!). ????

thanks Ildergreier!

[eternitys_child]

What's up! Atxunicorn I'm in Houston so we're kinda neighbors lol.

welcome to the forum

[Scottie2Hottie]

I think I've exhausted every resource I can dig up. Now just to make sense of my findings and tie it all together in a cogent fashion. I'll try to report after work today.

[Atxunicorn]

Ok I think I found a new method of application. I put my organic coconut oil on after showering, then put on my perfume followed by the pheromones (today’s choice: tester 2 sprays of Desire Me+ On wrists, below the belt and rubbed chest and neck, 1 tester spray Connections on the back of my neck, then a dot not a spray of Tease.

Im noticing the Tease is way stinky compared to the DM+ and I’ve been using Tease since Saturday and I’m still not adjusting to the smell.

Lets see see what this mix does today!!

p.S. perfume is a vanilla body spray

[eternitys_child]

what do you mean by "dot not a spray" ?

[Scottie2Hottie]

Ok so I tracked down Adronone and Copulandrone….sorta. They are ingredients in a product called Osmopherone produced by the Italian chemical company Vevy. Technically the chemical composition of Osmopherone as per their website is Reconstituted Andronone, Copulandrone and Copulin-alike. They also produce a product called Osmopherine which consists of Pyrolline Isovaleriante and Buttirate. They had a link to a bibliography so I thought I might find more information. It turned out to be nothing more than marketing copy. Vevy refers to their products as "pheromonic copulines". They never come right out and call them pheromones. According to them Osmopherone is a "male copuline" and Osmopherine is a "female copuline". I was a bit confused by this because copulins are vaginal secretions and since men don't have vaginas they can't produce copulins. I thought ok maybe copuline with an E is something else that I'm not familiar with. So I did a search. The only result I found was thefreedictionary.com. They consider it an alternate spelling of copulin. So I'm already losing faith in this company with the whole male copuline thing. It was as if they had no understanding of what they were talking about.

This didn't make sense so I dug a little further. Next I looked up Andronone. The only result was Osmopherone. Then I looked up Copulandrone. Same thing. I searched medical journals, a couple dozen endocrinology journals and biochemistry journals. Nothing. I even went straight to major pheromone manufactures. The compounds simply don't exist. At least not outside of Vevy labs. Surely if these were organic compounds they would be found somewhere. For known hormones/pheromones there is a metabolic chain. They all start with cholesterol and thru a series of enzymatic conversions others are formed on down the line. So the question arises how can a supposedly organic compound exist independent of the metabolic chain? Furthermore the term Copulandrone is highly suspect. Are they implying that they spliced copulins (female) with an androgenic (male) molecule? Highly unlikely. Technically copulins as produced naturally are a combination of 5 volatile fatty acids. Which one or ones did they use, if they did at all.? Then there is copulin-alike. What the hell does that mean? Are they implying that Osmopherone contains copulins? Why not just say so? That's what they supposedly use in Osmopherine so why not just list those chemicals. I investigated Pyrroline Isovalerianate and Buttirate. As far as I can find there is no such thing as Pyrroline Isovalerianate. Although I couldn't find it in my research it is possible that Isovalerianate is some unknown ester of Isovaleric Acid. Methylbutanoic Acid aka Isovaleric Acid is one of the fatty acids that make up copulins. It's what's responsible for copulin's pungent Parmesan cheese, sweaty smell. Esters of Isovaleric Acid have a pleasant odor. This may be their reasoning for esterizing it. But the thing is that if you alter the molecular structure you change the way it behaves. Think of the difference between Alpha Androstenol and Beta Androstenol. Minor change in molecular structure, big change in behavior. Then they further altered it by attaching one of the Pyrrolines, of which there are 3 each differing in the position of the double bond. This molecule no longer comes close to being the copulin which is naturally produced. Then there's Buttirate. or more correctly Butyrate. It is an ester of Butyric Acid which is also found in copulins and has an even more unpleasant odor. Butyrate is actually a generic name for any number of esters. Being an ester it has more pleasant odor. But again by altering it's structure you alter it's behavior.

I found a Russian study that used Osmopherone and Osmopherine, not surprisingly donated by Vevy. The study involved ticks and the abstract asserted that they were attracted to these compounds. In all honesty an abstract doesn't really tell you much. Coming from a research background I know that research methods can often be flawed, even fraudulent. Most research is conducted in a university setting. There is a great deal of pressure on professors to publish. It is usually a condition of their employment. There is also a bias against negative outcomes, not to mention a bit of ego involvement in their hypotheses being disproved. A researcher is free to omit or include any data they choose. So I took a look at the actual research paper. It mentioned that ticks are highly prone to dehydration. So they put a tick in a petri dish and introduced various stimuli. What the researchers fail to mention in the abstract is that the ticks were equally drawn to water. Keep in mind that Osmopherone and Osmopherine are hydrophilic or water soluble. They were introduced to the petri dishes as an aqueous solution. So if the ticks are equally drawn to water then it stands to reason that water and not the so-called "pheromones" is what attracted them. They would have been drawn to the water even in the absence of any pheromones. Upon further scrutiny I noticed that they claimed that Osmopherone is a derivative of Androstenol. Osmopherone claims to contain 3 distinct chemicals so which one is the derivative and why do they use some made up names instead of the chemical name? Next they provide the following of which it is unclear that they are referring to Androstenol or the derivative: 4, 16-androstandiene-3-on. That molecule is definitely not Androstenol. In fact, that molecule does not even exist. It is however quite close to Androstadienone (4, 16-androstadien-3-one). Androstadienone is not a derivative of Androstenol. It is synthesized from Androstadienol. Androstenol is actually an indirect derivative of Androstadienone, not the other way around, and lies further down the conversion chain. Androstenone is the intermediary between them. So obviously these researchers don't have a background in chemistry, endocrinology or pheromones. The question remains did they come up with this erroneous information themselves or was it provided by Vevy? In another study, cited in the tick study, they claimed that Osmopherone had an impact on endocrine (hormones) and reproductive systems. In this case they claim that Osmopherone is a derivative of Adrostanediol But which form of Androstanediol? There are 4 different ones. Androstanediols are Testosterone metabolites. I suspect that they were referring 3-Alpha Androstanediol. If this the case then what they are actually referring to is most likely Androsterone. 3-Alpha Androstanediol is an androgen and precursor of Androsterone. Once again we find that these researchers also lack an understanding of chemistry, endocrinology and pheromones. In the tick study they refer to research that supposedly validates the efficacy of Osmopherine as a pheromone. I read that research. It had nothing to do with Osmopherine. The study was to identify the constituents of copulins in the vaginal fluid of women. While it didn't support the assertion made it was a very informative read.

From what I could gather Vevy seems to lack credibility. The research that supposedly supports the efficacy of their products certainly does. Assuming, and this is a big assumption, that the perfume you bought contains any actual pheromones, and I highly doubt it does, then they are probably male pheromones.

I hope you don't mind me rambling in your thread. It was a fun and educational journey. I learned a lot along the way. Thanks for the impetus.

[Prettyrickyboi]

I'm trying to figure out what degree you just got writing this paper lol. great stuff Scottie, I read every bit of it.

[Scottie2Hottie]

Good question. Pheromonology? Geekology? lol

[Atxunicorn]

Eternitys-child, instead of spraying I removed the spray pump and just dapped the tip of the sprayer on my skin. That way I wasn’t getting the full spray.

However yesrerday I tried 2 full sprays of Tease but applied it with my new method of showering, then apply my coconut oil, followed by my vanilla perfum, let them dry before spraying Tease. Huge difference! The smell was no where as pungent at it has been when I applied Tease directly on clean skin followed by applying perfume after Tease.

[Atxunicorn]

Scottie2Hottie

Holy Moly! You weren’t kidding about going down the rabbit hole. Great research and information Scottie2Hottie. I’m going to have to do a read over on all this info again without morning brain fog.

Thanks!

[Scottie2Hottie]

Lol No I wasn't. Actually I'm always researching something I just don't always report about it. I'm a curious person and like learning new things. The great thing about doing research is you start out with maybe one or two basic questions and that serves as a spring board leading you in different directions. More often than not I end up with more questions than answers. You never really know where it will lead. The research is the easy part. The hard part is solving the puzzle. This latest undertaking was quite a challenge. I kept hitting a lot of dead ends. It required me to approach things from different angles. Most of my research is pretty linear. This project had me going around in circles.

I apologize for the clutter in my post. For some reason the space between paragraphs was removed upon posting. I tried editing and putting them back in but they kept getting removed. Eventually I started getting a system error message so I stopped trying. I didn't want to risk losing the whole thing. I put a lot of time and effort into that report.

[Prettyrickyboi]

O.o I wonder what the most shocking thing you ever discovered was.

[Atxunicorn]

Scottie2Hottie is all good just hadn’t had my daily pitcher of coffee in me before reading it lol. Your research journey sounds like one I went down for a few months on the subject or “chemtrails” that lead wayyyyy down the rabbit hole and lots of dead ends leaving way more questions. Researching is fun. However more fun if it produces answers.

[Scottie2Hottie]

chemtrails? Do tell.

[Atxunicorn]

Oh I’m not going on the path again it stresses me out lol

[Scottie2Hottie]

lol Fair enough. While I'm not entirely certain that I know what you're referring to it sounds similar to some things I've been pondering lately. Basically phero reactions in relation to context and association. I may actually post about it in my journal soon.

[Atxunicorn]

Oh it has nothing to do with pheros. It deals with weather modification.

[Scottie2Hottie]

Interesting.....I may just have to look into that. Like I need a new adventure. lol

[BobiiJo925]

First time Pheromone user! I’m excited to see what happens

If I haven't already said it I'm so glad to see you on your phero journey

[Atxunicorn]

BobiiJo925 Thank you very much! Now to actually put myself in places where they can possibly get some hits instead of sitting around my house lol.