Pheromone Epiphany

[Dioxonus]

I cannot believe myself it is unbelievable I just had a huge epiphany. I know why my mones aren't as effective as they should be. It was me all along. I just read up on some stuff regarding why masturbation is bad and can mess with your testosterone levels and make you beta. I am not going to lie I have hit rock bottom of the fap addiction. I do it everyday(I know guys/gals TMI! but I am just honest) this is bad and I hope to change that. Each time you masturbate or watch porn your body releases a surge of prolactin and gives you the feeling of satisfaction but this is bad as you feel sleepy and not wanting to do much. With the prolactin increasing after each "fap" it reduces the testosterone(not a lot of it but some) and of course makes you feel beta. The other problem to "fapping" excessively is that it gives you social anxiety and making you feel beta (That is why I am not game) and of course when we feel as we are not worthy of them 10's. Without smacking the meat you will be more attractive to women and your conversational skills increase as you have adequate T levels.

Due to my problem I seem unattractive to girls and I feel worthless. This could possibly have an impact on my game and pheromone effectiveness. I have noticed back when I started a year ago. (Yeah I never used to "fap" until I was 18 as I just didn't want to and you feel more sensitive when having sex and you have wet dreams; which are normal way to release excessive amounts of man juice). Sex is better than masturbating as we all know that a woman releases copulins on the man and that boosts his testosterone levels so sex is good.(Kindly have lots of it lol)

Some info why excessive mastubation is bad
http://www.2knowmyself.com/Why_mastu...elf_confidence

So I accept the challenge of not "fapping" for 2 months straight and I shall an increase in my manhood and use my mones effectively as they will be working with my T levels. I need this to help me from destroying myself as porn and excessive masturbation can mess with a man's sex drive. I will keep a journal of this(Not on here of course unless SteveO allows me) How far I get and my self effects. I wonder if there is any subliminal's that can also help me through my journey. Let's do this!

P.S Sorry if this might be to provocative but I needed to get it out to help other men and many mone users.

[MrGoodbar714]

Wow... Just wow!!! Thought I seen everything here lol. This is what we call a "slippery slope"...

[Dioxonus]

Wow... Just wow!!! Thought I seen everything here lol. This is what we call a "slippery slope"...

Yeah it does sound really weird but this could affect the mones in a certain way. It does seem interesting

[MrGoodbar714]

Iain I'm NOT agreeing with you... This is a myth... Besides that, I find your logic to be false. I find it a bit weird that your drawing conclusions and suppositions from something on the net without getting clinical verification of your supposedly low test.

[2000GT]

Well, excessive dependency on porn to masturbate can cause psychological and physiological issues, though a better way to increase T levels is to avoid soy based products, eat a better diet and foods that help naturally stimulate T and start hitting the gym. Lifting weights on a regular basis has many benefits including an increased metabolism as well as T levels. That's my two cents.

[Magnus]

@IainLPplus44

Interesting theory of yours and here is a wikipedia link that supports some of your ideas. On the other hand I have read the masturbation increases T and if you don't do something with that juice your body will start making less of it and we all know where that leads. lol.

On the other hand let me share my life experience with you. Its quite odd in some ways and no one I have ever met has had the same experience.

I started masturbating when I was 12. I'm sure many of us did, but I doubt that doing so made many of us feel like we were sick afterwards. I realy felt like crap for the next couple days after masturbating. It had nothing to do with emotional or mental issues...I physically felt like shit...no energy, depressed, etc.

I still masturbated though because it felt good and the orgasms felt better than anything I had ever experienced in my short life.

As I arrived in my late teens and married, I still had those feelings of depression and utter lack of energy after orgasm. So bad that it affected my marriage although I never told my wife about the issue because I was afraid she would think it was her and leave.

Throughout my life I've had that problem until I reached the age of 44. It was at that time I started to no longer lose energy after orgasm but instead to feel more energetic. I was able to bounce up and do whatever as well as start to get another session of love making going if the lady was so inclined.

What changed? I don't know, I only know I'm glad it did.

I can tell you that I have suffered from low T my whole life and it was just about a year ago I started treatment for that so don't think that hand anything to do with it but you might want to have yuor hormones tested and see if there are any anomalies present in your body.

As for the site you listed......seems its a little over the top but there does seem to be evidence to support what your saying and experiencing to a point. Why its happening is a much more interesting question and I'd love to hear what you find out.

Denial of self satisfaction may be a temporary solution for you but it will not solve the problem. You might just have a hormonal problem.

[MrGoodbar714]

How are you certain he has a hormonal problem?

[Magnus]

Because it just does not sound like a typical reaction for someone his age. Now we can go the mental illness route and look for something there, or we can go the hormonal route and see whats going on there. In his thread on Pherotruth he says he is overweight and thus probably producing more estrogen.

I guess almost certain is rather strong ( edited in post above ) so lets just sat that its worth looking into because virtually all guys his age are walking sperm shooters. lol. I know a guy who's son goes to the lavatory in his school everyday and deposits a load of the stuff or so he claims. Goes back to class and does his thing all day..no loss of energy.

17 and 18 are not that far away in age.

Either way, if I was him, I'd talk to my doctor about this and find out whats causing it. I wish I had when I had the problem I did but I was too ashamed. I'm not now but I don't have the problem.

[MrGoodbar714]

But what exactly is his reaction!? Reread his post again... There is none. Sounds alot like self-esteem issues more than anything else. So the mones aren't working as well for him, so his mind races... What could be the problem??? He thinks, "well I'm overweight and masturbate alot... (Slippery slope) My test must be low!" He digs and finds that source, along with the greatest scholarly source Wikipedia (in psychology we call this confirmation bias). Now... Not every overweight dude is going to have low T and/or produce excess E, just like not every overweight person is going to have high bp or diabetes (let's move away from those stereotypes). A few things tell me it's not low T... 1. Age: Very rare for kids his age to have low T, unless they just got off a cycle and failed to do a proper PCT. 2. The simple fact that he has the DESIRE to masturbate that much says his libido is still intact. 3. Erections... Still getting them enough to jiggy jiggy jerk it... Should he go to his PCP, sure... Why the heck not... But I'm willing to bet he is just fine.

[Dioxonus]

But what exactly is his reaction!? Reread his post again... There is none. Sounds alot like self-esteem issues more than anything else. So the mones aren't working as well for him, so his mind races... What could be the problem??? He thinks, "well I'm overweight and masturbate alot... (Slippery slope) My test must be low!" He digs and finds that source, along with the greatest scholarly source Wikipedia (in psychology we call this confirmation bias). Now... Not every overweight dude is going to have low T and/or produce excess E, just like not every overweight person is going to have high bp or diabetes (let's move away from those stereotypes). A few things tell me it's not low T... 1. Age: Very rare for kids his age to have low T, unless they just got off a cycle and failed to do a proper PCT. 2. The simple fact that he has the DESIRE to masturbate that much says his libido is still intact. 3. Erections... Still getting them enough to jiggy jiggy jerk it... Should he go to his PCP, sure... Why the heck not... But I'm willing to bet he is just fine.

I don't understand the hostility from you. Was it something I said? That wasn't a wiki link by the way. I never said my T levels are dangerously low. All I said is that it lowers it (This could be a very small amount) But it lowers it. I somehow feel like you are in denial that you smack the meat to much or you could be a muscle douchebag And yes I do have less confidence and self esteem due to other stuff which in fact does lower our game at picking up girls. I have also studied that if you are stuck inside masturbating you feel lesser that you can't pick up girls. Being addicted to porn messes with a guys brain It has been proven. So Instead of being hostile go do some research.

[Dioxonus]

http://pherotruth.com/Thread-NO-FAP-Challenge?highlight=no+fap+no+porn

[MrGoodbar714]

You're wrong on all accounts. Reread your post, read what you put carefully. You're making claims as if they are factual. Ignorance breeds MORE IGNORANCE... Oh you studied huh? Well take some classes in biology, sociology, and psych instead of "researching" garbage non scholarly, non peer reviewed articles. I WAS trying to help you kid...

[XSteveO]

I really haven't read through the whole post, but I get it and I applaud you for recognizing something that you feel is a hindrance in your journey to be the best you. There is a website dedicated to porn addiction called "Your Brain on Porn" that you should look into. There have been numerous posts on other forums, one which you linked to. Anything that prevents you, even if its a personal mental blockage without any proof whatsoever, is still a challenge you have to overcome. Just recognizing it is in itself a major step in overcoming it.

While I cannot prove scientifically if masturbation is what sets men back when it involves dating, but from my personal observations I can say it does. This was my own feeling when I had some "slumps" with meeting women. Two things tend to happen when my game is off and I experience rejection: The first I push myself even harder and chive on until I succeed. The other less desirable course is I go deeper into my head thus further from the passion of my heart, and take the easy way out.

The more masturbation the less likely you are to be motivated to speak with a women, even if you get rejected. When I was in a pickup community and winging newer guys to the community, I started a little experiment. The guys who were most afraid or with anxiety were the ones most likely to masturbate. I knew because I asked. I did my best to get these guys to undertake an experiment and promise not to jerk-off for the entire week until the next time we went out to pickup. It was absolutely clearly visible the ones who abstained from masturbation between meetings as those were the guys most motivated to take risks to meet women.

Now I don't know about the correlations you posted, but I do plan to further research it, but I do know from personal observations and expereiences that the more you jerk-off the less likely you are to take the risk of rejection. Why bother getting rejected when you can go home imagine you took that hot babe in those wonderfully delicious form fitting jeans home for a marathon session of complete sexual debauchery.

That's just my opinion though and there's nothing to substantiate it. I also get what MrGoodbar714 is referring to as well. I'm a victim of my own self-deceptions as I believe we all are. We seek out the easiest way to take the blame off ourselves even if the blame we place is on something that is in our control. Its still easier to say hey jerking off is fucking up my life than it is to say hey I'm fucking up my life. I get it. However taking responsibility for our action is still a step in the right direction to take responsibility for ourselves. Putting the blame on something, even if that something is directly a result of what we do, is still easier than putting the blame right squarely on ourselves.

Now I haven't read the whole back and forth, but we have to start somewhere and this is a pretty huge step to start on. Recognizing it is going to change your outlook and lead you to make the adjustments to become successful. What I believe MrGoodbar is suggesting is now that you recognized this as something you need to take control of in your life, don't add all this other stuff in to tell your brain you haven't got control over it. Its like me saying I need to go on a diet because I'm fat, but because I'm fat I have to go to the doctor to ensure my diet doesn't hurt me. In that scenario I'm taking responsibility for my own self, but then adding in all these variables and giving control over to things not directly in my control.

What I'm saying is you've recognized something that bothers you, now own it completely. Don't hand it over to anything else. Its yours, take it and make it happen. No one is going to solve it for you.

You're on the right path

[Dioxonus]

Thank you Steve. I did not mean to make a flame war. I am sorry for that and I am sorry to you MrGoodbar for jumping to conclusions.

[MrGoodbar714]

It's all good. Now go score you some poontang.

[Magnus]

I to am not trying to start a flame war but here is my experience.

When I was 19, I got married. Me and my wife screwed like bunnies for the four years I was married to her. I had low T even at that time in my life but I still had sex and fapped with the best of them.

I remember masturbating 12 times in a single day once and my poor pecker would not move for three days afterwards. lol An peeing was a nightmare. lol

How could I have such a high sex drive and still have low T? I have no idea other than to suggest the the human sexuality systems are more chemically complex than we understand at the present time.

[Dignify]

12 times a day? Holy cow xD Man that's suicide xD

[Magnus]

I've been thinking about this whole thing since this was posted. Even restrained myself from whipping the old salami for a few days and took a good look inward to see if I noticed anything different.

Yes, yes I did notice a difference in my desire to approach and open women.

Now as to a way to counter the effects the poster was talking about I would suggest cops. This is one of the main things missing when a man masturbates rather than having sex with a woman. Sure there are other hormones involved, but, cops are the one that seems to balance things after sex. I noticed a very great increase in energy after having sex with a woman vs. having sex me wee little hand. lol

So here is what I plan to do. Get my greedy little hands on a small supply of cops wear them and me and my hand are going off in a dark corner to do the nasty. Afterwards I'll observe myself and see how it goes.

Then a couple days afterward I'm gonna repeat the experiment without the cops and observe in the same manner.

Instinct tells me that cops are going to prevent some to all of that tiredness, decrease in rone, and cancel the sleepiness.

Not 100% sure, but I bet that it does.

Only product I have of Steve's that has cops in it is Ascend. Not sure there is enough in there to make a difference though. What do you guys think?

[Dignify]

According to K's post somewhere here, Ascend has little cops compared to domination. So if you want to experiment that thing I would suggest Domination.

Kimba what do you think about this?

[GHOST]

No cops in domination, SOB yes.

[Dignify]

Oops I'm sorry! I meant to say Desire Me... Should have more cops than Ascend, thank you Ghost, but SOB? I didn't know it contained cops!!

[Dignify]

Also, just heads up Magnus before I forget! Dont use Desire Me at home, if you have a lady, after you do the stuff lol.

Stuff will pretty much heat up, and in the bad way.

Unless she knows what you're up to and not actually cheating

[Magnus]

No lady at home at the moment. :( Hopefully that will change soon